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U.K. trio London Grammar pose in front of a dark background

London Grammar

Photo: Alex Waespi

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London Grammar Find Catharsis On 'Californian Soil london-grammar-hannah-reid-interview-new-album-californian-soil-finding-catharsis

London Grammar's Hannah Reid Talks Finding Catharsis On 'Californian Soil,' Stepping Into Her Power & Facing Sexism In The Music Industry

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GRAMMY.com chatted with London Grammar frontwoman Hannah Reid about the London trio's transformative, deeply personal third album, 'Californian Soil'
Ana Monroy Yglesias
GRAMMYs
Apr 16, 2021 - 11:20 am

British alt electro trio London Grammar have been putting out emotive records that perfectly straddle the worlds of cinematic alternative, ala Florence + The Machine, and moody dance music, with big name DJ remixes and collabs a major part of their catalog. This is in a big part due to frontwoman Hannah Reid, whose haunting voice can soar over and weave into seemingly any beat, evoking strength and tenderness in a single breath.

Reid met guitarist Dan Rothman in 2009 in college, who recognized her talent off the bat and pushed her to perform. Keyboardist and drummer Dot Major joined a year later, and after finished school, the trio moved to London, where Reid and Rothman are originally from. As soon as they began releasing music, London Grammar made waves.

Back in 2013, they landed the closing feature on Disclosure's massive dance chart topping debut album, Settle, bookended by the release of their debut single, "Metal & Dust" and LP, If You Wait. That year was peak moment for both alt/indie bands and euphoric dance music, and they not both fit in perfectly with the current sounds, they also offered a unique fluidity between them that has allowed them to continue to sound fresh and exciting.

In 2017, they dropped their sophomore album, Truth Is a Beautiful Thing, but the persistent, grating sexism she faced within the music industry was forcing Reid to seriously consider if she could stay in it. 2019 brough another massive dance collab, "Let You Know" from Flume, which Reid shares they wrote during a very dark time for her.

Yet in August 2020, amidst the unpresented global shutdown, London Grammar returned with the euphoric summer love jam, "Baby It's You," the lead single to their new album, Californian Soil, released today, April 16. The powerful, deeply emotive project is not only a musical triumph for the band, it is the result of a healing journey for Reid, who used it to channel her anger and frustration and find strength and power in the process.

Shortly ahead of its release, GRAMMY.com caught up with Reid over the phone to learn more about the emotions behind the new album, stepping into her role as bandleader, her experience with sexism in the industry, and more.

The third London Grammar album comes out soon. What does California represent to you?

California, to me—basically those lyrics just came out when I heard the music. Dan [Rothman] in the band had this guitar loop with that beat on it, and it just evokes those lyrics and that imagery. I do think that California has this kind of mysticism to it.

It's a place built on this extraordinary landscape. It's got a lot of layers to it and that's why people do write about it a lot. It seems to be on the tip of everyone's tongue and I don't really know why, but it's such a beautiful word as well. It's one of those words in the English language that just is really beautiful in itself and makes you feel things.

Why did you choose "Californian Soil" as the title track of the album and how does it point to the rest of what's explored on the album?

It's funny, when I said that I wanted the album to be called Californian Soil, everyone was like, "That doesn't make any sense, you're called London Grammar. People will just get confused. You're not from California." And I was like, that just makes it even more amazing, even more reason to have that as the album title.

It was also one of the first songs that we wrote in the process [of making the album], the first two songs were "America" and "Californian Soil." That's why the album is bookended by those two songs.

Those songs mean so much to me because before writing those songs, I wasn't in the best place. I wasn't really sure if I could do this anymore for a living. And then we wrote these two songs, and I loved them so much. And it felt appropriate then to either name the album America or Californian Soil.

Listening to the album, I definitely feel a lot of emotions, there're a lot of tracks and themes on it that really grab you. For you, while you were working on the project, what sort of emotions were you tapping into?

It was very emotionally intense for me, definitely as emotionally intense as the first album, which I think is a good sign. The emotions I felt, I mean, I started off in quite a negative place and then I feel like this album healed me in a way. So, there's definitely light and shade emotionally on there. It has love songs that are very personal to me. And it also has a lot of darkness on there, which is obviously something that London Grammar does have usually. And a lot of anger, I was quite angry when we started.

I wanted to talk a little bit more about what it felt like for you stepping into the role of the leader of London Grammar on this album. And I know you mentioned that you were in a dark place when you started, did you feel like stepping into that role and claiming that space helped you move through those emotions?

Yeah, I think it did. I think that for me, it was a little bit of a now or never moment. I felt like I just wasn't or hadn't done a very good job, I wasn't fulfilled by my role.

Obviously, being a woman in the music industry, it's been harder for me sometimes to be respected by certain characters, not necessarily my bandmates, but people external to us. And I felt like, if we're going to have longevity, this needs to stop happening. I can't feel this way because it's so draining.

And in order for that to change, people have to know that I'm the leader of the band when we step into the room. Even if the music is then made in a democratic way, the lyrics are mine, a lot of the songs are mine and it is my story. And the boys just completely understood that and we agreed. I think they felt sad for me that I had felt the way that I had felt. And I don't know, maybe I hadn't made it that clear to them at times.

On this project, what did the songwriting and collaborative process generally look like with you and the band?

It started off in a very intimate way, which, again, is actually how the first album was made. A lot of the songs were written in pairs, so it was just either me and Dan, or Dan and Dot, or me and Dot. And we basically built up an album of demos. We had a lot of demos, a lot of material. And then it was only at the very end of the process that—it was actually our A&R who sent a couple of the songs to George FitzGerald.

It's funny, it's one of those moments, [our A&R] actually did it without fully telling me he was going to do it. And I was really annoyed. And then he played me the songs and I was like, "No, they sound really good." So, we sent the parts to George FitzGerald and he added some magic on a couple of songs. And then, also at the end of the process, I did a writing session with Steve Mac, which was quite scary, but turned out really great. But essentially, 90 percent of it was made by us three alone.

And how do you feel bringing on the co-producers for a couple of tracks, George and Steve and Charlie [Andrew], how do you feel like that shifted the sonics versus your other projects?

To be honest, and this is in no way a disservice to the people that were involved, but I think what was great is that we had a lot of the sound already there, we weren't trying to find a sound through going into studios with other people.

I think for us as a band, that was quite key. And then what it was about with getting, with George and Charlie, they had a production role, it was about adding a bit of magic and tying together some loose ends. Charlie rerecorded my vocal on a couple of songs and he rerecorded some of the guitar parts and stuff.

With Steve, it was more of a writing thing, which is a whole other interesting process because I actually have had a lot of very unsuccessful writing sessions in the past. So, I was nervous to do that, but he was really lovely and I really loved working with him.

I just love the euphoric, summary vibes of "Baby It's You." I know that came out last year, but now that it's spring here in L.A., I'm vibing with it again. What was the inspiration for it?

Exactly. We wrote that song, I think, in the summertime and it is about summer and being at festivals. And it's quite a meaningful song, again. It is a love song, it's about finding yourself.

I'm really glad you say that because I think that's actually quite an important part of music sometimes, the weather, and I don't think it's something to be dismissed. And I hope that with the album coming out there are those summery euphoric moments, and I hope that this summer will be a bit more hopeful and people will therefore connect with the music.

I also love "Lord It's a Feeling"—it just really feels raw and powerful, with heartbreak and those difficult emotions. What did it feel like for you writing about that in a direct, honest way?

That was quite a scary one actually. And I think you can hear it, because I swear in that song and, wow, I suddenly get a bit quiet because I don't think I've ever done that before. Obviously, I personally connect to those lyrics as well, and what's hard sometimes about being a songwriter is you don't want anything to be revengeful, but sometimes that's a real emotion too. I just feel like, unfortunately, that's the price you pay as an artist. I wanted to just be honest about the experience that I've had in the past, but also that some of my girlfriends have had too.

And when you were recording it and singing it, what did it feel like for you?

It felt very cathartic, it did feel really good. I feel like sometimes I, as a woman in music industry, I've been a bit discouraged from expressing anger and I just didn't like that. And I think it's such an important part of this album for me. It doesn't have to be a negative thing. I don't think like that at all.

"It felt very cathartic... As a woman in music industry, I've been a bit discouraged from expressing anger and I just didn't like that. I think it's such an important part of this album for me."

It's so true. I think women generally are discouraged from being angry. So, it's really powerful to hear and feel those emotions in music. If you feel comfortable sharing, what are some ways you've been pushed away from being honest in the industry, or from releasing certain songs?

Yeah, sure. I mean, it's funny when I first started talking about this in interviews, specifically the [February 2021] NME one, I shared the funny stories that had happened, the more lighthearted ones; the [more] sexist things that happened, I didn't actually share. Because I felt, I don't know, scared to really say what the experience was like.

There are women in the music industry who have experienced far worse than me, of course. But it was an absolute daily battle that I was not prepared for. And at the start of our career, we were surrounded by different people, we work with different people now. And I just felt it extremely profoundly, they did things like we didn't really have full access to even our schedule. And when I asked to see the schedule, I wasn't sent it. And I mean, that happens to young artists no matter who you are, but there was a lot of stuff like that.

Things weren't transparent, let's put it that way, no matter whether it was the scheduling or financially, with deals and stuff like that. And I remember asking nicely and that not working and then becoming a bit more frustrated and then feeling very put in my place.

And when it became a real issue and I became really angry, like, "I want to see my own schedule!" and of course, things were getting booked left, right and center that we weren't approving. I just had the most profound experience that I was treated like I was being absolutely irrational. We didn't have the control that we needed at the start of our career, and on top of that, battling for that control.

I remember specifically there was one person in particular who we worked with. If we were going to speak to them, I would have to get Dot to speak to this person because I knew I couldn't communicate with this person at all. Again, that's one example, but being on the road was hard, and walking into studios when it being assumed that I was not really a musician, even if I wrote the song.

That was quite a funny one because I'm like, literally there is nothing else I could do to prove that I am a musician when we're working on the song that I've actually written. But it was kind of death by a thousand cuts, those little experiences amounted to actually something that was really tough. And now I feel like I can speak about it and I don't want to dwell on the negativity. I hope that I've turned that negativity into something more positive, which is an album and feeling strong in that.

Switching gears a bit, your 2019 collab with Flume, "Let You Know," was massive. What was it like working with him?

It was really great. He was over in London and he's a friend, he's a really great guy. So it was very easy. Again, when we did that collab, I wasn't in the best place. I think my confidence was really low. So, I'm glad that it was with someone who was so nice. He was quite patient while we were finishing the song. And I'm a massive Flume fan. It was definitely a "pinch me" moment for sure.

What did you feel like when it was released?

I felt really excited and just like, "I wonder how this will go down." With Spotify, it's sometimes kind of hard to tell how something's actually being received. I performed the song with him when he did a show in London and I think that was really when I felt it the most. I was like, "Oh, this is just so great."

Was everyone singing along?

Yeah, they were. And it was also really fun because it wasn't a London Grammar gig, I went out and I did one song. It was just like walking into a party for five minutes and then leaving.

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I was wondering if we could hear a little bit about your path into the music industry? When did you first start performing and making music, and at what point did you start thinking about it as something that you would pursue professionally?

So, I was always writing songs and singing, but I am a deeply creative person, so I never considered that you really even could do it for a career. And I didn't really understand what the music industry was.

It was only when I met Dan, before we met Dot, where he was like, "Oh, you're really good. We're going to do a gig." And "I booked it in and it's next week and we're going to do it." And I was like, "Oh, okay. I'm really scared and I don't know how I feel about this." And then it was a bit like that every step of the way. When we then signed a record deal, I was like, okay, I guess this is happening. I don't really know what just happened, but I guess I'll just go with it.

And it's probably with this third album, so it's taken me this long to be like, actually, this is a career. And asking myself "How do I want this career to look?" Because yes, I'm very creative, but I do think they are important questions because then you don't get taken advantage of, when you know exactly what it is that you want. And probably only now, do I really understand that.

And do you remember how old you were when you first started writing music, and what you were writing about?

Yeah. I mean, just so many boys who just really upset me when I was really young. I remember my first songs that I wrote when I was 11, 12, 13, just those painful angsty teenage songs, which, really, a lot of that was on the first album. But my mum does say that I was making up songs when I was like four, five, six. I don't really remember, but apparently I was.

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Bearcubs

Bearcubs

Photo: Jacob Lindell

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Bearcubs On 'Early Hours,' Berlin & Art For Change bearcubs-talks-early-hours-berlin-art-platform-change-scoring-his-first-film

Bearcubs Talks 'Early Hours,' Berlin, Art As A Platform For Change & Scoring His First Film

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The British singer/producer also talks how about discovering Flying Lotus inspired him to produce electronic music, writing "Everyplace Is Life" on a train and the biggest thing he's learned during quarantine
Ana Monroy Yglesias
GRAMMYs
Aug 7, 2020 - 12:39 pm

Laid back, curious and easy to chat with, U.K.-born, Berlin-based electro-chill artist Bearcubs, a.k.a. Jack Ritchie, embodies the relaxed, bubbly music he makes. Growing up playing drums, piano and guitar, he started producing chillwave-leaning electronic tracks in his final year of college in 2012, posting them to SoundCloud during that golden age of bedroom producers.

His second EP, 2017's Underwaterfall, featured steel drums, water drips and enchanting moody soundscapes and saw major outlets comparing him to James Blake and Jamie XX. Not long after, in 2018, he moved from his longtime home of London to Berlin, released his debut album, Ultraviolet, and scored his first film.

This May, while quarantining in Berlin, Ritchie released his sophomore album, Early Hours, 10 tracks of effervescent, cloud-watching daydreams inspired by memories from his final months in London and first year in Berlin.

Bearcubs · Early Hours

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GRAMMY.com caught up with the British artist to chat about his latest album, moving to Berlin, scoring for film and learning to limit screen time during quarantine. Ritchie also shares how discovering Flying Lotus in college inspired him to produce electronic music, how he believes art as a major platform for social change and more.

You recently released your sophomore album, Early Hours. How are you feeling about sharing this project, and what was your main goal with it?

I'm pretty excited to share it, to be honest. Before I put these three singles out, I hadn't really released any of my music in about over a year and a half. So I took quite a long pause between previous projects and this one, just because I didn't really know exactly what I wanted to do. And I did a film score, which took up a big chunk of time. I had a lot of time to think about what I wanted to do musically. Also, when I moved to Berlin, it was a bit of a growing point in my life, because I was living in London for years before then and was leaving some of my friends and family behind.

I wanted to use the album a bit to sum up my past three or four years living in London and the experiences I had there, going out and working in pubs and living with a bunch of mates from home. All of this stuff, I just wanted to get this feeling into the album. Maybe a little bit nostalgic, yeah. I didn't want to go into that too much because I think you can overindulge nostalgia. It's a kind of bridge between my life in London a few years ago and then moving to Berlin and meeting new people and getting to terms with that whole situation.

That's so cool. When did you move to Berlin?

It was just about two years ago now, August of 2018.

Do you like Berlin?

It feels like home now. I love it. It's such a chill place to live. I was coming here on holiday and I realized I was coming here more and more often. It was every six months, then every three months, then every few weeks, and then it was like, "I might as well just live here." For me, it's got such a chill and kind of impossible feeling. And there's lots of interesting creative stuff going on. It's quite a 24-hour city. All of those kinds of things made me want to be here.

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Last year, you scored the German film Relativity. How was the creative process for that project different than with Bearcubs, and is scoring something you'd like to do more of?

I was a bit nervous actually, because I've never done a film score before. But it was one of those things I just couldn't say no to it because it was too much of an opportunity. And it was a real challenge, but it was a lot of fun, because I'm used to working within I guess what you'd call a pop writing structure, with five-minute songs. To work with a film score, I had to think about things in terms of 15, 20 minutes and moments happening in the music—things have to become intense and then the music has to fade into the background and not interfere.

It was definitely a different process. The way I started most of the music for the score was I got a rough cut of the film and then I just sat with the piano and watched some of the main scenes. I sketched out the idea of what the mood would be on the piano and tried to get some of the timing right. And I had a lot of contact with the director, Mariko Minoguchi. It was basically a collaboration with me and her because it was her first film as well, so I was like her baby. And I think she entrusted me to make the music because she thought I could do something a bit different and interesting with it as opposed to going with a hardcore experienced composer.

When I went to Munich, she took me through a lot of the story and broke down what she wanted the motives of the characters to be and stuff. I made a lot of music that I sent to them where they were like, "No, that's not quite right." We did a lot of back and forth until we got to a good place. It was really fun to do.

How do you feel like moving to Berlin has influenced your art and/or creative process?

Well, it definitely just gave me a bit of time—for some reason, here compared to London, it feels a bit more relaxed and less hustle-y. Even though it's good to hustle sometimes because it drives you to do you stuff, in Berlin, I feel like there's a little less competition and it's more like people boosting each other up, like a community thing. I've definitely been influenced by that, as well as by the people who I've met.

I've met a lot of really cool, interesting artists here. One of the first collaborations I did when I got here was with a producer and a friend of mine, narou. Literally the first stuff we did, we ended up making "Overthinking," which was the first single on my new album. So yeah, I've done collaborations with people here and the vibe of the city and the people I've met have influenced me.

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I feel like being in a new place can really do that. How long did you live in London? Or is that where you grew up?

I feel like I've always lived in London even though I didn't, because my hometown is just above London, about 20 minutes away. It's a smaller town called St Albans. It's quite a nice place. Growing up, I was always going into London, and later I lived in various places in London, for about six years in East London and Tottenham. I mean, I love London, but I felt like it was time for a change. I wanted to mix it up a bit. Especially since coming here to Berlin, I've felt new surroundings is always good for creativity and giving you new ideas.

You shared that you wrote the lyrics for one of the lead singles, "Everyplace is Life," while on a train in the U.K. Can you tell us more about that moment that inspired the song, as well as the creative journey that led to the finished product?

I often do this thing of making loads of notes in my phone. Sometimes it's just a word, literally, or I see a book title and I write that down, or a little stupid poem or something like that. I kind of use it as my little second brain that I can go back to. For "Everyplace is Life," I think it was a couple of summers back, I was on the train down to Brighton to play the Great Escape festival. And I don't know, it was just one of those days when you're in a really [good mood] and everything's just wonderful.

It was kind of that. I was in a good mood, and it was that thing when you're on public transport and you look around and you see everyone else—sometimes you forget that everyone else has got their own life, and there's all these stories. And you're like, "I wonder where that person's going. I wonder what they're doing." And you kind of imagine these stories about everyone's lives. It is kind of about that, about those little moments in life. And about slowing down and appreciating little moments, whether they're good or bad at the time, they're all kind of meaningful.

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I love that. You said you wrote the lyrics a few years ago, right? And then when did you pick it up and create the beat and the melody?

Yeah. I can't remember exactly [when I revisited it]. I think it was maybe six months ago. I don't quite know what made me do it, but I was like, "Oh, I've got a song that I wrote a while back. I still haven't used it." And I remembered the feeling when I wrote the lyrics and just started from that and started making the beat and the chords. My influence for the track was the Little Dragon song "Ritual Union." I've never heard a track before that's very constant all throughout. The beat keeps going and it's very driving and repetitive, and I wanted to make a song like that, that kept going and didn't really stop. "Everyplace is Life" is me trying to do that, because the beat and everything is relentless through, and then the lyrics are the thing on the top that give the changes and make it interesting.

And then for the album overall, about how long was the process?

Yeah, it was maybe spread across a period of a couple of years, but I'd say in total it was probably only seven months of doing it. I wrote a couple of the tracks a couple of years ago, "Everyplace is Life" and "Diversions." And then I moved to Berlin and spent six months doing the soundtrack, so that took up all my time. After that, as I'd had a while off from making my music, I desperately needed to make something.

Basically, the whole of the rest of the album came in about a period of a few months. It came in a flurry. After that, it was choosing the tracks and refining them, and all of the boring technical stuff at the end. But yeah, it wasn't actually very long. It all came together at the end. I was just looking back at stuff over the past few years, and mixing that with the experiences I've had sincemoving to Berlin.

You launched the Early Hours podcast this year. What is your vision for it and what did it feel like to step out of your "comfort zone," like you said when you shared it, in that way?

Yeah, it was definitely something out of the box for me. I'd never done anything like that before, so it was a nice thing to do. Whenever I do something that I'm a little bit nervous of doing or I wouldn't usually do, I always feel like I get something more out of it. Once we started, it felt really easy. Especially because I was with narou and another friend James Hersey, who's a singer and also based in Berlin. It was kind of like hanging out with your mates, talking about music, which is kind of what I wanted the vibe of the podcast to be. 

I think in the future, I want to make it a bit more centered around having a record player in the middle of the room and everyone brings in a vinyl. When I was at uni, I had a record player and I'd go to the record shop with my housemate and we'd buy a record and then put it on and drink a cup of tea and listen to a whole vinyl. And just look at the front and back covers and the lyrics on the inner sleeve. I feel like that's kind of lost from streaming stuff online. That's my future vision for the podcast. It's kind of something which enables you to slow down and listen to music and chat about it in a relaxed way. Who knows what's going to happen with it, we'll see.

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When did you first start making music? And at what point did you think it was something that you wanted to do professionally?

I mean, I've kind of been making music most of my life. I started pretty young playing drums, at seven. And then piano and guitar, and in my teenage years, I was in quite a lot of bands. I played guitar in a funk band and I was in a '90s hip-hop band playing bass. I played in some hardcore punk bands as well. I didn't really get into electronic stuff until I was at university, because I did digital music and sound arts. I got introduced to electronic music by people who were in my course and I was going to university with.

That opened my mind up to electronic and dance music, because don't think I really respected it fully before. I was always into hip-hop and some electronic stuff like Prodigy and bands like that, but I was never really fully into it. But when I heard some of these producers, especially the early beat scene people like Flying Lotus, the way they make their beats, you can't tell what's going on. You're like, "How on earth have they made this?" I think that's what made me want to start producing. Now I've become a bit more jaded I guess, because I know how things are made and I've got my producer's ear a bit more, but if I don't know how some things were made, that really excites me.

I started putting stuff up on SoundCloud and getting a bit of a following, somehow. I got a paid remix, and I was like, "Oh my God. Someone's paying me to make music." That's what made me think, "Oh, I could do this professionally as well." So I started devoting more and more time to it. Before then, I might have made one song every six months, and now I'm trying to make one song every day almost.

I always love hearing about the evolution of the music that someone is into. When you started university, what did you envision you would be doing at the end of it?

I don't think I really knew. I kind of went to university for the sake of it. I didn't know what to do. I was into music, but I was also not really sure what I wanted to do musically. When I was 17, I wanted to be a guitarist. But after uni, I kind of stopped playing guitar and was way more focused on electronic stuff. I think I was just exploring and figuring things out. And then when I did start making more electronic stuff and when I started the Bearcubs project, then I felt like I had more of a goal of like, "Okay, this can go forward and can go somewhere."

Who was the first remix you did for?

It was a weird indie duo from the U.K. Their label got in contact with me and asked, "Do you want to do a remix?" And I was like, "Yeah, definitely."

And it was because of the music that you had put out yourself on SoundCloud?

Yeah, exactly. It was just people finding me through my SoundCloud stuff, which I was amazed about, like, "How have you found me?"

Do you remember when you put your first song up on SoundCloud?

It would have been 2012, the year I was leaving university. Yeah, it was kind of dumb, I only really got into electronic music when I was leaving the electronic music course. That's the way it was. It was a track called "Measures," I think, and it had a "Breaking Bad" sample in it. I hadn't even watched the show, but there was this awesome vocal sample where he's like, "You either take a half measure or you go the whole way," or something like that. I guess it was like chill wave. I was listening to stuff like Toro y Moi and Flying Lotus and Baths.

Read: J. Ivy Talks Making Music For Social Change, Leading With Love & The Importance Of Supporting Black Artists

What do you feel like is the biggest thing you've learned about yourself during quarantine?

That's quite a good one. I think I was getting way too much screen time before. I realized I was waking up, looking at my phone, then having breakfast, then working on my laptop all day, while looking at my phone in between when I was taking breaks on my lunch. Then having dinner and going back on my phone, and watching Netflix or films and stuff. So I'd literally spend my whole day on a screen. I don't know why quarantine taught me that, but I think it's because I was indoors so much that it just became more realistic to be [on] the screen so much.

Now I have a policy where I don't check my phone until like 10 or 11 in the morning, once I've got up and done everything. I've been trying to look at my phone less and read more and not be on the computer as much.

How do you think music and art can bring about social change?

I think the power of music and other art forms is that it can sum up a mood of a time or generation in such a subtle but precise way. It's such a powerful platform for change and rebellion because everyone in the world is consuming culture on a day-to-day basis. We are all affected by the events going on around us even if we don't realize it consciously. As artists, this manifests itself through what we create, and as people through what we want to see and hear. It resonates with our current mood and sense of place in the world. The '60s was such a big period of change in women's and Black people's rights as well as freedoms and the opposition to power structures—the culture, fashion, music and the ideas of peace and love were completely reflected in that and tied together with the political message.

Listen Up: From Aretha Franklin To Public Enemy, Here's How Artists Have Amplified Social Justice Movements Through Music

In your opinion, how can the music community contribute to dismantling racism?

I think now it's about going above and beyond to support and boost up Black artists. It's disappointing that the music industry has benefitted from Black music without acknowledging its culture. It's about checking our privilege and becoming aware of how we perceive Black and non-Black music; making space and giving Black artists a voice across the music industry; demanding more diverse festival and gig bookings; and making more of an effort as artists to collaborate with and lift up our Black brothers and sisters. In an ideal world, we would embrace all colors and races, but the level of inequality and racism now is so ingrained in our societies that we must face this and make conscious efforts every day to change it.

Up Close & Personal: Duckwrth Talks Celebration Of 'SuperGood,' Respecting Black Artistry, "Insecure" & More

ZHU onstage

ZHU

Photo: Joey Vitalari

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ZHU Talks New Album 'DREAMLAND 2021' 2021-zhu-dance-rave-album-dreamland-asian-americans-interview

ZHU Talks New Rave-Ready Album 'DREAMLAND 2021,' Being Inspired By Hyphy Music & Asian Americans Finally Being Heard

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ZHU's third album, 'DREAMLAND 2021,' is a tribute to returning to the dancefloor that invokes a dark, sweaty warehouse rave and features support from Channel Tres, Yuna, Tinashe and more
Ana Monroy Yglesias
GRAMMYs
May 14, 2021 - 8:56 am

Back in the summer of 2014, a driving, moody deep house earworm called "Faded" crept into our ears, swiftly becoming an inescapable bop around the world. It topped charts around the world—including hitting No. 1 on Billboard's Dance Club Songs chart—and made the then-mysterious singer/producer ZHU a star of the global dance scene and a GRAMMY-nominated artist.

Since his big debut, the artist born Steven Zhu in 1989 in San Francisco, California, has demonstrated his dexterity as a vocalist, producer, remixer, and collaborator, keeping mainstream dance music interesting and innovator. He's worked with Skrillex, SOFI TUKKER, Bob Moses, TOKiMONSTA and Majid Jordan, to name a few.

ZHU's third album, DREAMLAND 2021, released April 29 on Astralwerks, is a tribute to returning to the dancefloor, invoking a dark, sweaty warehouse rave, featuring support from Channel Tres, Yuna, Tinashe and more. GRAMMY.com caught up with the "Zhudio54" artist ahead of the immersive, powerhouse new album's release to learn about how it came together and what he thinks the future of dance music will look like. He also shares what the response to "Faded" felt like for him, the influence of growing up in the Bay Area on his music and Asian Americans' ongoing struggle against racism.

Let's start with the new album. Can you take us inside the dream of DREAMLAND 2021?

Yeah. For me, I think I've evolved quite a bit in the last couple of years sonically and just in my craft. I think from the beginning, people didn't really know maybe all the different assets musically that I was able to put in audio format because, even up to a couple of years ago, people didn't know that my voice was on the records or that I had written some of this or that.

This record definitely allows people to peep more into more of the whole 360 perspective of my music—from the production, to the vocals, to the features, to the different sonic landscapes. I'm pretty excited to let people get a taste of it.

Not unlike the last album, there are a lot of awesome collabs on this one—including Channel Tres, Yuna and Tinashe. How did you choose who to bring into the mix on this one?

Everything, honestly, that I do, it's just been pretty organic. I think getting in the studio with an artist always leads to either the best or worst. [Laughs.] I think with electronic music too, it's a lot of times we'll just send stuff out [to collaborators] and you never know what you're going to get back. But I really make it a point to craft the songs and the way I think the mood and direction goes. For this record, working with each artist was great. They all wanted to be on it and it was all pretty organic.

Meet Channel: Channel Tres Talks Honoring Isaac Hayes On EP 'Black Moses,' Healing With Music & Being A "Ghetto Savior"

Were the collaborations all remote or were you able to meet up in person with anyone?

I recorded everybody's vocals at my studio. The Yuna song ["Sky Is Crying"], her and I had written an earlier version of it a long time ago and I randomly stumbled upon it one day. I was like, "This song is really great, I want to put in a club." So, I redid the song and sent it to her and we finished this version of that record pretty much this year.

What was it like working with each of them?

Everything has been fast. I mean, I don't really do more than one or two takes on anything. I feel like if you're not going to get it with instinct it's not—I don't look at it as filmmaking, where you have like seven, 12, 50, 100 takes. Music is emotion first, so if it doesn't make you feel something immediately, then I usually go away from it and come back later. Or it just comes out and it's there.

And obviously, there's a lot of refining process but I've been trying more and more to keep things rolling and not as super-polished, pristine, because I want the character as well.

It's pretty easy to say this album will sound really good on a dancefloor and any kind of big-speakers situation. What do you think raving in the hopefully not-too-distant future will look like?

I think people are ready and I think when people get that taste of the feeling, they're going to go crazy. They've been starved and they're going to feast.

Do you think it's going to happen this year?

Raving? Yeah, definitely.

Related: How Will Coronavirus Shift Electronic Music? Maceo Plex, Paul Van Dyk, Luttrell, Mikey Lion & DJ Manager Max Leader Weigh In

Almost everything was shut down, but we've never had clubs and events close to this degree ever, really. Do you think it's going to lead to a new wave of dance music or that there's going to be a new underground sound? Obviously, things are going to be different, but what does it look like in your head?

Yeah, I mean, I think the people who are in it for the music are going to survive and the people who are in it just for the cash lifestyle, they probably found an alternative. Sonically, and from an underground perspective, I think it's bigger than ever. And you have people all across the world being able to access sounds and sets and know about artists that you could never have 20 years ago unless you were crate-digging or something like that.

I think it's going to go back to being kind of a purist genre, but everybody wants to experience it. So, I think we'll have a second boom, kind of a Renaissance phase for dance music and I think it just needs to be authentic and it's going to grow pretty quickly.

And for you, as a DJ/producer, what does the energy of the dancefloor feel like from that perspective?

I think a lot of dance music has been pretty geared towards streaming and radio in the past decade. I'd like to see more dancefloor-focused and groove-focused stuff. But again, with that said, I'm also not inhibited to just four-on-the-floor and having to create something that is just super 124 [BPM], all-night-long stuff.

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You're actually returning to the stage very soon with your DREAMROCKS shows [at Red Rocks Amphitheatre in Colorado]. What are you most looking forward to about having an audience again?

I'd say to feel it again. Everybody is looking at the future of having these shows, but it's not the same until you really get onstage and it sets in. Right now, we're just talking about it, but talking about it does nothing until you actually get up there and really get in that moment and understand, "What am I performing now?"

It's been over a year and a half, and just to get that spark and get that kind of connection again with the fans is really the first step for me because I don't like talking about making music. I just make it.

Looking back a little bit, what did the massive success of the GRAMMY-nominated single "Faded" feel like for you back in 2014?

That was the beginning of everything. It was such a gargantuan first record that I think the expectations for me have been [high]. After that, I was like, let me just go create bodies of work and really allow people to enter this world that I built, instead of trying to chase hits and trying to replicate and manufacture the same sh*t over and over again.

I really tried not to let ["Faded"] be the metric of what I was doing, even though that was responsible for probably the biggest record released and then charting and blowing up and being in all these countries instantaneously, that I've experienced.

Did you have any idea that it would take off like that?

Nope, but I always just knew that people had a reaction to the record. I just didn't know that 60-plus countries would all be playing it. And that I would hear it in person, in some place in a distant country that I didn't even knew played my records.

Just Dance: How Nora En Pure Brings The Natural World Into Dance Music

Going a little further back, how did your experience growing up in the Bay Area, attending raves as a teen, inspire you to start making dance music yourself?

Yeah, when I grew up, I think a lot of the culture initially was hip-hop and the hyphy movement that was going on in the Bay Area, [led by] E-40 and other [rappers]. And it was this era, there was a swagger, there was a Bay Area kind of lingo, there was a Bay Area pace of life, a way you'd drive. It's hard to explain unless you grew up in that era there.

A lot of the beats for those hip-hop records were super simple. They weren't super complicated, like sampled Kanye [West] beats or like [old-school] New York hip-hop. At that time, it was very simple, just 808s, synths, and everybody just dance. It wasn't necessarily story-telling, lyrical aficionados. It was "Let's bounce with the cars, have a good time."

I think that influenced a lot of electronic music of that period of time too, in which people just wanted to just have some slappers. And I try to keep that in mind all the time, to try to not over-complicate stuff, to simplify things to where people can just really feel the rhythm around the world, in every single country. Everybody knows how to move their body regardless of if they can understand the lyrics.

When you were younger and going to raves, was there a moment when it clicked, like, "Oh, I can do this. I can make electronic music"?

Yeah. In the beginning, there was a Haight-Ashbury scene, which was a lot more kind of indie [music], like jam bands and rock, with rock clubs. And they had raves in the Cow Palace, which was huge. It was a lot of trance going on at that time, and very deep, elevator house music going on.

I didn't really realize until I was a little bit older, probably 19 or so. It was in the middle of a show and I had this realization that 10,000 people were just staring at one person playing music, and that was enough, that was the future. It didn't need to be eight people up there playing instruments. It was one person doing it. I had a sudden realization like, "Why isn't that me?" and that began the curiosity.

That was a very transitional period in San Francisco's history, before all the tech people came in. It was very much music- and art-driven, from everything to bands, to hip-hop, to DJs.

It seems like it still had a bit more of that lingering '70s vibe. Not so much anymore.

Nah. I mean, there would be Sundays in [Golden Gate] Park, were you'd go rollerblading and there'd be drum circles. There were just more artists there, but then everybody left.

This past year has been so much, a lot of darkness, a lot of unfortunate violence in addition to the pandemic. And it's all especially impacted communities of color. How do you think as a country, as people, we can better support and protect the Asian American community?

For the first time, the Asian American people spoke up and were heard and had a voice. In the last 10 years, I don't really remember where there's been significant, overwhelming support from other people solely on Asian American issues. And I think people now realize that America, in 2021, is made up of a lot of different types of people.

And most of these people have lived here for at least a generation, and they grew up at the same high schools, eat the same food, listen to the same music, they just have different skin color. They don't, especially for Asian Americans who grew up here, really identify with the native country that they're from because they didn't grow up there, but at the same time, they look like people that grew up there.

And you have this expectation of living in both worlds and carrying two burdens. And obviously, there's so many Asian countries and each one has their own unique culture. So it's hard to just generalize all that. But being in America, you are just generalized.

Yeah. That's such a good point, that it really has been an accumulation—it's not like racism against Asian Americans just popped up last year.

No, it hasn't. It's been around since any Asian person has come over, from Chinese people to Japanese people, and back to the Chinese Exclusion Act [in 1882] and Japanese internment camps during World War II.

The good thing is people are talking about it now and they can do their own research and they can go dig a little further. I don't really expect other people necessarily to fully understand, but I think if they're willing to listen, then that's already the first step.

What's your biggest hope for this year?

I think that without live events—everything from sports, to concerts, to just being able to go to city gatherings like San Francisco's Bay To Breakers [race and parade]—people need to see other people doing things that they enjoy. Then, it won't so distant and categorizing different types of people, because at these shows you get to meet new people who like the same things and then you have a personal connection with them. You get to learn about their stories, you get to experience things with them and it makes you much more open to different things.

And I think all the energy stored up, from not being able to release it, has caused people to channel it in other ways, some positive, some negative. If you can't mosh at a show, you're  going to go mosh protest, if can't go trip super hard at a rave, you're going to do it elsewhere, you know what I mean? So, at least there will be a place for people to know that there's other people that are similar to them, and I think that's a big, positive thing no matter what. Bad things happen all the time, but knowing other people go through it with you is probably one of the most comforting things.

Sama' Abdulhadi Is Techno & Techno Is Freedom

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The Knocks in 2020

The Knocks

Photo: Joe Perri

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Record Store Recs: The Knocks record-store-recs-knocks-brooklyn-online

Record Store Recs: The Knocks Reveal The Grooviest Shops In Brooklyn And Online

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The beloved New York electro duo The Knocks take us to their favorite vinyl stores in the Big Apple and on the World Wide Web
Ana Monroy Yglesias
GRAMMYs
Feb 11, 2021 - 1:36 pm

With the unprecedented global disruption of COVID-19, it's important to support the music community however we can. With Record Store Recs, GRAMMY.com checks in with vinyl-loving artists to learn more about their favorite record stores and the gems they've found there so you can find some new favorite artists and shops.

New York-based electro-pop duo The Knocks–consisting of Ben "B-Roc" Ruttner and James "JPatt" Patterson—have made a name for themselves with their upbeat bops and energetic live shows. Their last album, 2018's New York Narcotic, is a kinetic tribute to the city they love and that loves them back. On Feb. 5, after a year without concerts, Ruttner released his vibey debut solo album, Holiday87 (which is also his solo project's name).

While New York may have finally caught up on sleep in 2020, the pulse of the city—its music—never really stopped. For the latest Record Store Recs, Patterson shares the act's favorite vinyl hot spots and what's on their vinyl wishlist.

Holiday87 · Daybreak (feat. The Knocks)

What are three to five record stores you love?

Second Hand Records in Brooklyn, New York

Superior Elevation Records in Brooklyn

Human Head Records in Brooklyn

Discogs (online)

Juno Records (online)

The Last: Record Store Recs: Producer Bongo ByTheWay Shares The Music Of His Mind

The Knocks' Ben Ruttner at a record store

The Knocks' Ben Ruttner

Why do you love these shops? And what kind of goodies have you found there?

Second Hand, Superior and Human Head are all run by great DJs and have well-curated selections. They also happen to be good friends, and we love supporting the community. We have found some great older house records and rare disco cuts there.

For at least one of your favorite shops, share a recent record or two you bought there and what you love about the record/artist.

We haven't been doing as much analog digging due to COVID restrictions and basically quarantining for a year with no gigs. We have, however, purchased a few jams online, one of which we've been obsessed with by a relatively obscure artist named Jesse Henderson. It's called "I Did It Again" [1977, Lasso Records].

The Knocks go vinyl hunting

What's an upcoming/recent release or two you have your eyes on picking up and why?

There's an Al Kent release that's coming out [on March 8 on Million Dollar Disco] called "The Loneliest One" that sounds like an absolute melter. It's definitely on our Juno wish list. There's also a Dimitri from Paris edit pack on the way. We are always excited about his stuff because it's usually heat.

Another Record Store Recs: Salt Cathedral Talk Favorite Brooklyn Indie Shops & How To Support Artists Of Color

How would you describe your record collection in a few words?

Funky house, disco and edits mostly—for getting the party started.

In your opinion, what can music fans do to better support Black artists and businesses?

I think real fans are already good about showing support by purchasing/streaming/sharing our music, but I think the industry could do better about supporting Black artists and artists in general by giving us bigger cuts of money being made off the music we create.

Life On Planets Talks Astrology, Inclusivity On The Dancefloor & Why We Have To Be Like Martin Luther King Jr.

Black Coffee

Black Coffee

Photo: Alari Teede

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Black Coffee Talks New LP, 'Subconsciously' black-coffee-new-album-subconsciously-interview

Black Coffee On New Album, 'Subconsciously': "Music Is Life To Me And I Want You To Feel That With Every Beat And Melody"

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"That's what music should do, it should divide barriers and unite us under this one universal language," the South African DJ and producer says of his new album, 'Subconsciously'
Ana Monroy Yglesias
GRAMMYs
Feb 4, 2021 - 1:29 pm

If you have yet to immerse yourself in Black Coffee's captivating, atmospheric beats, now's a perfect time. The South African DJ and producer's emotive sixth album, and first in five years, Subconsciously, drops tomorrow, Fri., Feb. 5, on Ultra. To craft the enchanting soundscapes therein, Black Coffee tapped a diverse, talented group of collaborators, including vocalists Usher, Sabrina Claudio, Celeste and more, and fellow producers David Guetta, Diplo, DJ Angelo and Pharrell Williams (who also provides vocals on "10 Missed Calls").

Black Coffee has been big in the international house music scene since 2013. That year, he won bingo on the DJ bucket list, playing spots like Berghain in Berlin, Amsterdam Dance Event, Circoloco in Ibiza and his first Boiler Room set. In 2017, while he was busy bringing joy to dancefloors around the world, he made waves in the mainstream with his standout feature on Drake's More Life. "Get It Together" featuring Jorja Smith is a remake of Black Coffee's 2007 track "Superman," its pulsating beat traversing decades and borders.

The Drake spotlight led the talented producer to "Get It Together" in the studio with other heavy-hitters like Diddy, Akon, Usher and Pharrell and to where he is today. Subconsciously is a culmination of Black Coffee's two-plus decades refining and redefining his sound, limitless beyond borders and genres, yet rooted in his South African identity—he's never too big to work with fellow artists from his home country.

Ahead of his exciting new album, GRAMMY.com caught up with the "Wish You Were Here" artist over email to dive deeper into the project and its collaborators, as well as what representing South Africa means to him.

What does your new album Subconsciously represent to you? What was your creative vision for this project?

When jumping into this new project, I wanted to remind the world that we're not confined by genres. As an artist, that's a value I hold very close to me. I create music that I can connect with, that provokes a certain emotion.

That's what music should do, it should divide barriers and unite us under this one universal language—and that's exactly what I wanted to do with Subconsciously. My artistic touch will always be defined by my music, but I want to break barriers and convey a global message, not just on dancefloors. This album goes way beyond. 

Read: Record Store Recs: Producer Bongo ByTheWay Shares The Music Of His Mind

There are a lot great collabs on the project—how did you choose who to work with on this one?

There are different processes for making every song and so I didn't go into this album thinking that I had to work with a particular artist. As the music evolved, we played around with many different elements. Sometimes a particular voice just meshes well with the direction of my production and it works. Other times, we're pitched a vocal and I adapt my music to make it feel right. These different processes sort of create an equal playing field for collaborators. 

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What is your favorite part about working with other artists? And what do you feel like is one of the more challenging elements of collaborating?

Sometimes, you've put your heart and soul into a particular song and you feel there's nothing else that can be done, but then you add another creative on board and the song is elevated to a place that you couldn't have imagined before. Every vocalist, producer or writer can add a certain key element that changes the whole dynamic of the music and I think that's the real beauty in collaborating. I wouldn't say there are challenges, only creative motivation!

More Convos: Popcaan Talks 'FIXTAPE,' Working With Drake And The Globalization Of Dancehall And Reggae

When you released "LaLaLa" with Usher in 2019, had you already finished the album? For you, in what ways did this track feel like a shift into new sonic territory?

Back when I released this single, the album hadn't been 100 percent completed. The general tracklist had been outlined, but we were still going in and adding finishing touches to make it what it is today. The creative process and journey in making this album spanned over a couple of years.

For me, it wasn't necessarily a shift, but rather a gateway to spreading the joy of different sounds and reminding people that one particular musical way of thinking isn't superior to another. To me, if a song can evoke emotion and power, it's already done its job.

The music I am producing is oftentimes very different than the music that I DJ. I create music that you can blast on your car speakers or clean your home to. I create feel-good music that can universally bring us together. It's all about that feeling. 

"To me, if a song can evoke emotion and power, it's already done its job."

As a whole, Subconsciously is very captivating and immersive, and it definitely has a bit of a chilled out and moody vibe. How would you describe the mood and the feeling of it?

Every time I listen to Subconsciously, I have a new favorite song. That's what makes this album unique. There's something for every mood; it evokes a lot of emotion. You have the deeper sounds of "You Need Me" [featuring Maxine Ashley and Sun-El Musician] or "Ready For You" [featuring Celeste], upwards to the more poppy side of the spectrum with songs like "Never Gonna Forget" [featuring Diplo and Elderbrook].

What do you hope your fans will experience while listening to the album?

I hope that it brings anyone who's listening from anywhere in the world joy. That's what the music is all about for me. I've been working on and evolving my sound for pretty much my entire life. Music is life to me and I want you to feel that with every beat and melody. 

What does it mean to you to represent South Africa across the globe? What is a misconception people often have about your home country?

My South African roots are something extremely important to me. I want to bring South Africa to the world. The talent emerging from my country is growing by the day and being able to collaborate with outstanding artists like Sun-El Musician, Tellaman, Una Rams, Msaki and C-Tea, to name a few, means I'm taking the sounds of South Africa one step further on the global spectrum. It's such an honor to be able to carry the flag on a more global spectrum.

When people from outside the country or even further, the continent, think of South Africa, they have a very cut-and-paste conception, but it goes so far beyond that. My country is home to some of the most incredible musicians, artists and great minds, even beyond the obvious household names. Our culture is vibrant and booming and I'm so proud to call it home. 

Do you have your eyes on any rising African artists right now?

It's hard to pinpoint any one particular artist right now, as there is so much emerging talent. In the music world, there's Da Africa Deep, in the visual world, there's Ghariokwu Lemi, but these are just two of so many. I could go on for days and the scope is constantly changing and evolving.

Life On Planets Talks Astrology, Inclusivity On The Dancefloor & Why We Have To Be Like Martin Luther King Jr.

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Some of the content on this site expresses viewpoints and opinions that are not those of the Recording Academy and its Affiliates. Responsibility for the accuracy of information provided in stories not written by or specifically prepared for the Academy and its Affiliates lies with the story's original source or writer. Content on this site does not reflect an endorsement or recommendation of any artist or music by the Recording Academy and its Affiliates.